Campfire Chat October 7, 2017

Ayesha_Society:  Here are Marshall’s quotes from last week’s chat for your consideration . “Our judgement against the world and ourselves is the crown of thorns we wear.”

“The Greater Community teaching and reality is meant for everyone to learn. It is a teaching for the whole world. Yet the GC people will likely be the first to respond and to prepare.”

“(Regarding controlling emotions) Some emotions come from Knowledge. Do not try and control these emotions.”

justin-calif-!:  greetings all!
Betty_UK:  Hello everyone
manuel germany :):  Hi Betty – good to see you again 
Carol_Society:  It is now the hour everyone. Let us take a moment to be with those who have brought us together today, those to whom we are in service, those seen and unseen. To be with the Angelic Presence that watches over this world, with our Spiritual Family and with the Messenger, without whom we would not have the growing awareness, education and preparation so critical for contact with intelligent life in the universe. Our profound gratitude to all and to you, Marshall…
26610:  Just looking for my number
Debbie-MI:  Hello everyone.
Jim B. Upstate NY:  Indeed Carol! Powerful words! Thank you!!!!
mellany:  Hi everyone!
Richmond_UK:  Hi everyone
Inhee_Korea:  Thank you Ayesha for reminding the quotes from Marshall.
Katia_France:  Hello! Greetings to all!
Marianna Greece:  Hello everyone
manuel germany :):  Hi Rich, hi Mel, hi Katia – good to see you 
manuel germany :):  hi Mathieu_France 
Kari_H_Finland:  Rahn Ekan Novay Trenansa Misu Veda Maya Toom
mellany:  Hey Manuel! :))
Raoul_Australia:  Hello everyone, so glad to be here
Tonia _Denmark:  Bhello all. Nnc
Tonia _Denmark:  Hello too lol

Ayesha_Society:  Welcome everyone. We are beginning the first week of month two of the school session on the Preparing for Contact with Intelligent Life in the Universe. The central revelation for month two is called “The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity”.

Before we begin with the central revelation, “The Messenger Speaks: The Jungle” was released last week. If you were able to engage with this important teaching from the Messenger, what stood out for you?

Surina_Calif.:  Good Day, Everyone. Wonderful to be here. Nasi Novare Coram.
manuel germany :):  Hello Raoul_Australia 
Jason NJ:  hellow fellow students. So glad you are all here!
Keiko_Ita:  Hello everyone!
Mathieu_France:  guten tag, Manuel 
Kelton:  Hello and a good day to all!
MaryL_Boulder:  hello everyone to this beautiful clear morning. We had house moving winds last night .
Selma Londons Jungle ;):  In response to the question on the last Chat about response to public communication, and what MVS might experience as a result: The NMG is changing the ME whether it is acknowledged or not. However, during this time of polarisation there is the risk of people flipping out, panicking and over-reacting. Really these outbursts could be dangerous for any NMG student not following K. With laws against hate crime, coupled with the multifaith movement, there is some protection in our modern-day society, where there is talk of tolerance and ethics, even by President Trump.
I think there is a gradual turning taking place, but we haven’t yet reached a tipping point. That will be crucial. To prepare for that, NMG followers need to be practicing what we preach far more than now. We need to be living that future life as much as possible.
As we proceed forward I foresee more demand for MVS, as well as avoidance. The demand brings with it risks, of course. There may need to be security, as well as…
Selma Londons Jungle ;):  … vigilance. Perhaps MVS’ movements may become more restricted and scrutinised. He may remain an enigma, but will nevertheless need to be transparent and show accountability by demonstrating his ongoing responsibility to Source. For example, some people may feel left out or that there’s favouritism – such a challenge for a vast & diverse world to serve.
Already the NMG may appear to some to have a Christian dominance (albeit understandably) and the challenge will be to find a way towards ‘world ownership’ of the NMG in a way that everyone can identify with. Coming from America, from another white man, could be another challenge. People will need to overcome their own vested interests, perhaps particularly indigenous peoples. Urban areas, where people have already come together and blended to some extent, are already showing the way, even though these centres are also the most explosive!
People will be coming to MVS for answers, for solutions to upcoming problems, and want him to…
Selma Londons Jungle ;):  … summarise everything and make change happen for them. They’ll be wanting the impossible, without putting in the work themselves. How difficult to say no to those in desperation – we’ll probably all face this, and I certainly have mild versions of this on the streets of London, in the outer Jungle…
I’m already staying inside a lot more (literally and figuratively), but in the future I think there will have to be far more collective community activity.
“And Knowledge, which exists beneath and beyond the surface of your intellect, will work towards this relentlessly to orient you in the right direction.” The Jungle
Katia_France:  Hi, Manuel, great to be with you all!
11441:  Benjamin England, Hi
Kari_H_Finland:  I have now a better understanding why not every person is able to receive the Greater Community education. Without Greater Community background it is a challenge too great.
Jim B. Upstate NY:  @Carol for me there is so much we need to unlearn. God’s will for us is to unburden ourselves from our judgments, condemnation, idealism and ego etc. so that we may begin to learn anew. Yet, it is our task and our responsibility to work at this and do what we are being called to do. This takes a great deal of time, consistent practice and humility. The more I give myself to my practice the more i begin to journey outside the jungle. For me it all comes down to reclaiming Knowledge and to complete my/our purpose here. This is where our practice and preparation is so important!
Paul_MA:  This resonated and stood out: “God’s New Message for the world brings this forth clearly now, for many people need to be called to a higher purpose in a world facing catastrophic & unprecedented change. Many people must hear this calling & find the true path within themselves because the world requires it. And you have come here to do this, to hear this & to find this.”
Shrimayi Netherlands:  At this moment I hear a bird singing at the recording while Marshall is saying what Knowledge will give you. It immediately fills me with joy and gratefulness. “Knowledge within you will begin to set the clear path because it was established before you came into the world. And because you have this path, you have a greater purpose to recognize and to fulfill and to learn to follow through time and circumstance.
This will give you the power of decision in time; it will give you the power of discernment; it will give you the power of discretion. It will give you strength where there was only weakness before. It will give you clarity where there was only confusion before.
Dariel_Boulder:  Good Morning ALL!
Maureen_Boulder:  What stands out for me is that if you want to be with Knowledge, you have to want it, you have to call for it. In my experience that call needs to be sincere and strong.
Cole_Boulder:  Thanks for sharing your thoughts and insights, Selma
mellany:  Hi Benjamin
Kelton:  Hi Dariel ( :
Jens_Denmark:  What stood out for me was that the power to find the way out of the Jungle is called Knowledge.
Thérèse_FL:  AMEN! Maureen
Ilhun_Korea:  @Maureen: Thank you. ” if you want to be with Knowledge, you have to want it, you have to call for it.”
Lin_Boulder:  This whole teaching is mind-shaking for me, as it points directly to the current status of my mind. I need to be with the teaching.
Maureen_Boulder:  Yes, Jens. Follow the sense of rightness. It’s dropping crumbs for us to follow.
Jim B. Upstate NY:  Thank you Selma!
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ Kari that make sense.
Jennie_Netherlands:  This stood out for me: You have to want it, you have to call for it, and when it begins to emerge, you have to have enough self-trust to begin to follow it.
Aurora_Hawaii:  Beautiful Shrimayi!
Kristina_Boulder:  The Jungle (jungle of imagination, of fantasy) prevents you from moving, having a clear direction. In jungle there is no direction.
Tuukka Finland:  Thank you Jennie.
Ayesha_Society:  Selma thank you for seeing into the future around MVS. Those closest to him must also do this, this level of seeing, without becoming afraid.
Paul_MA:  Jennie- yes…”you have to have enough self-trust to begin to follow it”
Rudy_Boulder:  This spoke to me very clearly because I do recognize this within myself and it is a challenge to deal with weakness in a constructive way, once it is recognized. “And you will see that there is a part of you that is strong and a part of you that is weak, and that that part of you that is weak must learn to follow that part of you which is strong, which represents the clear path.”
Mike_LF_CAL:  @Selma, I have been feeling that way for a while now, feeling the need to bring the practices of a NM student into the world more in everything I do and putting myself out there much more as well.
Ellen_Society:  In reading THE JUNGLE, I realized that I was in that jungle deeply for the first 3/4 of my life. Only when I found the New Message 23 years ago, did I begin the pathway out. I’m forever grateful to have found and followed that pathway!
Heidi_Germany:  The term ‘Jungle’ is mentioned very often in the NM and I was always wondering, if I understand it correctly and now I am grateful to have received this teaching of MVS which perfectly makes it clear.
Ayesha_Society:  “This is something for you to experience, to consider: Are you really living the life you know you must live? If you are honest, you will feel the truth of what this means and says to you. And you will also see that you are living in a jungle. Your mind is full of thoughts and persuasions, conditioning—all those things that overlay the true purpose that is waiting within you.” The Messenger speaks: the Jungle
mellany:  Marshall’s own Teachings always move me, deeply. I look back on my own life and can see more clearly now that, even during times when I believed that I was “moving forward”, I was often walking in circles…sometimes not even cutting my own path .. just following the trails of others. Being born into “the jungle”, and living within it for so many years, it was all that I could see. I wasn’t consciously aware of searching for a way out, nor was I particularly happy about being here, in the world. Everything began to change from the day I found NMG. Now, I want to be here for as long as I work to fulfil my Destiny. I’m eternally grateful to Marshall, NMG and my Spiritual Family for guiding me towards “the clear path”. Finally, so many years on in this lifetime, and perhaps following countless others, I am beginning to realise, remember and to live, this “The clear path emanates from within you and aligns you with certain people who can support it and recognize it. It…
mellany:  … begins to change how you feel about things. It begins to change your priorities and your values in the most natural way because this is you beginning your return to what is true within you and the possibility that you could fulfill your destiny in this world, under the very circumstances which exist today.”
Hyeonam_Korea:  Thank you Ellen.
Amina Russia:  The turning point then is when you start seeking something greater in your life….something you know is there and you can not yet define it. This begins the way out…once you begin moving in the right direction there is a sense of rightness about your life that begins to emerge…..this gives you a contrast you will need to discern your way out of the jungle or confusion…Knowledge stays pure withing you..There is a part of you that is a strong and there is a part of you that is weak, and that part of you that is weak must learn to follow that part of you that is strong, which represents the clear path.
Paul_MA:  Ellen- same here; although I did not realize that it was a jungle, but thought it was my real life. The NMG has thrown a rope to me to climb out.
Jim B. Upstate NY:  @Maureen-I found it finally getting clean and sober I needed to experience a great deal of disappointment and suffering along the way! This molded me and brought me to a threshold in my life that I either “wanted” to stop drinking and using or I did not. On Aug. 24th 2007 I wanted to get sober. And in this I was actually wanting to CHANGE my life, my world view, all coming from the inside out. The NM is very similar yet oh so much deeper and meaningful to me. Yet, if I did not experience the things I did to get sober I probably wouldn’t be here with you all now. Things are not always what they seem in the moment. Understanding comes later indeed!
Russell_Sask:  Egads I was distracted by a SERPS generator presentation.
Alisa_Russia:  @Amina – very well said!
Tom_SanFrancisco:  Ayesha, re: human cooperation: I saw a study that said if people who are spending lots of money to leave their poor country (not because of war) were to take the same money to organize their communities they would have a better life than they will in the country they choose to flee to. i am thinking humans don’t trust each other, and there is good cause for that attitude.
Val_Westport:  Knowledge lights up the jungle around us and shows us the clearing within ourselves as well as the outside pathway to take us through what seemed such impassible territory.
Samantha_SA:  @Rudy – Thank you for your words “it is a challenge to deal with weakness in a constructive way, once it is recognized”
Carol_Society:  @Maureen: Yes, and “you have to have enough self-trust to begin to follow it.” This “self-trust” requirement was critical and still is. As I look back at my former life in the jungle, I now see that I did not have the self-trust to follow what I knew. Entangled, mired, no direction, stuck…the missing years…thinking I was out of the jungle only to find that I was in another. Yet having the direction, the tools, the compass, the pathway, the way-shower that is Steps to Knowledge. I wanted the way out, but also wanted what I thought I wanted. Then the power of Knowledge and Grace and “enough self-trust” bringing me to a place in the jungle where there was no other option but to slash and hack through the way out into the clear. And oh, my, what a clear space to behold: the Messenger himself, the mission, a new life.
Kari_H_Finland:  @Rudy, “Your mind is like a child who must follow the loving care and movement of Spirit.”
manuel germany :):  @Mel many thanks for sharing your experiences, insights with us
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ Mellany thank you your words resonates.
Dariel_Boulder:  @Selma…Powerful and insightful thoughts. Thank you.
Selma Londons Jungle ;):  Yes, Mellany: “You will find as you proceed that some of your failures will lead to greater successes, and that some of what you thought of as successes may lead to failures. This will underscore your whole system of evaluation and will lead you to a greater recognition. This will make it possible for you to be compassionate towards yourself and towards others whom you now judge for their successes and their failures.”
From <http://stepstoknowledg…w.htm>
Jennie_Netherlands:  My experience with self-trust to follow it is that there are so many thoughts and fears still that keep me away from where I want to be, with stillness and with the Presence. I follow the Steps every day, still…. I am just a beginning student and try so hard. I feel desperate and pray that Knowledge and wisdom will guide me to not make more mistakes which I see I have made with re-evaluating my life. I slowly become more honest with myself. I do trust that one day it all makes sense. I feel the calling and I know I need to stay with IT.
Maureen_Boulder:  Congratulations, Jim! Many have not been able to do what you have done. You obviously “wanted” to change. I’m glad you succeeded and are here with us to tell your story.
Bob_CT:  Good morning everyone.
58680:  So if I somehow get rid of my thinking habit to think randomly, that means I am out of my mind jungle?
Maurice_Canada:  Truly the most motivating revelation to date. I embraced a re-evaluation of myself and what has happened over the years of my involvement with the NM of these past few years. The faith of continuing to be a student and my involvement with people in my community in my city to say has been steadfast. However, I have been made to see through this document that there has to be a continuation of work on those people I have had contact with who have shown a spark of interest. I feel I am on the verge of seeing that those who know me can receive what I have exposed them to. It looks as if I only need to give them more materials and contact information as well as walk them through the steps to get on the web site for them to explore thet gnawing feeling in their gut.
Tuukka Finland:  Tom I have a book from 1994 that stated that if all people in europe cut their ice cream consumption in half and donated the other half, it would fund the schools in all of Africa.
Dariel_Boulder:  Beautiful Mellany.

ray_Colorado:  “Your parents did not have to consider this. Your ancestors did not have to consider this. They had other problems, some of which you no longer experience. But you have problems that they never had to experience.” ( The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity )

“My Teacher spoke of these things to me over eighteen thousand years ago. I did not believe him. He came again and again. I would not listen. It seemed irrelevant. The times were difficult. The old empire had passed. Civilization was scattered and lost, and many great ones were driven underground and destroyed. Pursued they were. Records of history were destroyed. It was a period of great undoing.
In the face of such calamities, the words he spoke seemed barely relevant to me. And yet I chose to listen, for I had heard his words before. An ancient chord was struck in me, an ancient memory. I had a recall of an experience before birth that I could not forget. They placed me on a dais and prepared me to enter the world. They cast…

ray_Colorado:  … a light over my head and they said, “You will not forget this light.” And I remembered. My Teacher, who is with me now as he was then, prepared me. Things that you encounter are far less difficult though you have many more needs and complexities in your life than we did. Food and shelter—these were our concerns. You have many concerns we did not even dream of.”
( Secrets of Heaven: Secret 67 )
Dariel_Boulder:  Good Morning Bob from CT.
Samantha_SA:  @Carol thank you so much for sharing your own experiences and the importance of self-trust
Betty_UK:  Hi Manuel 
Russell_Sask:  Switched Energy Resonant Power Supply the future of high efficiency energy generation, Thanks Nikola I almost forgot about that stuff on the way here…lol
Kari_H_Finland:  Thank you Ellen. 7 years ago I was forced to step out of the jungle. After that I found myself drifting in the draft in the middle of shore-less ocean surviving day by day for 4 years until I encountered the New Message from God. I found the shore and the new journey for me began.
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ Jennie thank you for your honesty.
Jansett_KY:  I’m reminded of one of my favorite quotes from The Sacred Life: “Heaven responds to those who are building the sacred life, who have the courage, the self-honesty and the fortitude to do this. They are the ones that Heaven will attend to, for they are the ones who show promise for themselves and for the well-being of others and ultimately for the advancement of humanity.”
MaryL_Boulder:  @Ellen, yes early on in my life I definitely felt the world was an overwhelming jungle of confusion and misery and my internal world was a jungle as well so I withdrew and tried to create my own internal world of order…making people and things good/bad/right/wrong. This judgement only made me suffer even more until I found the New Message. Here Knowledge is my compass although not as tangible as I thought in the beginning yet It was a feeling I had to learn to trust…Quite a journey to find what it truly means to follow this invisible bedrock called Knowledge that I must stand upon.
Aurora_Hawaii:  @58680 I think the Steps to Knowledge will help you align your mind so you can work with it better.
Kari_H_Finland:  …drifting in a raft
Ayesha_Society:  @Lin, “the current state of mind”this teaching also exposes how perhaps we are still living in the jungle in varying degrees, as we become honest when looking at current state of mind and condition: wanting other things, desires, social expectations, conditioning. The freedom journey is still ongoing. Yet what a great blessing that the NM is providing this ladder to find the way out, a step at a time. No longer walking blindly this thick jungle, with no way to see through it.
Paul_MA:  Jennie: You will find over time as you stay with the Steps that somehow you will be changed from the inside out.. Mysteriously this change happens although you will not know this till later and look back at the changes to your life and self.-Paul
Ellen_Society:  @Kari – yes, we were given the opportunity for a new life. That ,too, has been a challenge, but an immensely rewarding one!
Alexandra_NL:  Thank you Ray for sharing secret 67
Chrysostomos:  In the jungle our minds are the monkeys. Jumping continuously without stopping.
Ilhun_Korea:  It was the very time I really wanted to get out of the jungle when I met NMG.
Lin_Boulder:  @Ayesha, the jungle and the ladder, beautiful analogy in NMG of human condition and remedy from God.
Paul_MA:  Ray- thanks for sharing Secret 67;- I recall reading that with amazement.
James_Boulder:  The words “direction” stand out to me. What a gift to have direction, even in the midst of the jungle, if there’s clear direction and it is being followed the experience of grace and rightness can be had.
ray_Colorado:  Jansett_KY: “You are called to this sacred life. You are meant to have this freedom because it is only here that your greater gifts can be recognized and given to the world, where they are meant to be given. It is only here that you are free to go where Knowledge wants you to go. You are free to leave situations that must be left behind. You are free to find those individuals in the world with whom you have a greater association. You are able to forgive your past and the endless conflict and degradation in the world around you. You have become strong enough to guide your mind and direct your thinking sufficiently that you can hold to a greater course in life.” (The Sacred Life ) http://www.newmessage….-life
Carol_Society:  @Mary, Ayesha: Yes, “the current state of mind.” This teaching has made me ask this regarding my previous time in The Jungle: What are the “effects of the Jungle” that might still be within me. Where is there still confusion, no clarity, no direction, no discernment? Times when I am not really “right with myself”? What in my life, my mind that is still a jungle, jungle-like? What do I know here, and do I have “enough self-trust’ to follow what I know?
Mathieu_France:  thank you, Jennie. it’s important.
Jansett_KY:  @ray_Colorado, Thank you.
26610:  Christopher: Jungles are also one of the richest, biodiverse environments on earth filled with medicines and resources. Maybe these resources are what comes from turning our past “mistakes” into opportunities?
Kari_H_Finland:  @58680 I also used to think that the control of your own mind is the key but the NMG proved it to be a wrong idea
Arthur:  Finding the New Message is not equivalent to having found your way out of the jungle. The jungle questions your commitments, your beliefs and your honesty. The jungle will separate what’s real within you and what is not.
Carolyn_WA:  @Chrysostomos Yes! The term, “monkey mind” is apt. From a great Buddhist teacher. Not sure who though 
Lingling_Boulder:  in the teaching, it makes me realize that even in the jungle, I still can find the rocks(the step stones) that are overlaied but I still can find them if I pay attention. To find and follow the step stones takes focus, courage, faith, patience, determination, a lot of work… but that is the only way to get out of the jungle.
Joyanne_Canada:  very true Arthur, its all about preparation to end separation, the jungle we live in.
Tonia _Denmark:  Thank you, Ayesha. The jungle had amazing impact on me as it spoke so well about how this surrrounded by asphalt really had a negative throw back at us. Every where we look there is a response from something that many other confused and disappointed has looked at before. Life is not coming back into a person walking around or living in there. I never liked the city, hated it (what is hate?), and only came here to find the needle in the haystack and then get out of there. But that took me 22 years. And it was in the city next door, never mind that, but still. It just shows that no matter how hard we try find find the golden key to managing relationships without downfalls on both men and women no matter what age, it is not possible. For if you think about it the four pillars requires life, and since the city doesnt provide much happiness but the odd theater or cinmea or going out with friends, it is buildt on neccessities and business. Not on life or how to find life or happiness, though…
Tonia _Denmark:  … it appears to do so. But thats just business too. The misunderstandings are incredible and the pushing around is a waste of time for everyone. ……So I liked the part in The Jungle where he teach us that The Greater Path will emerge in time. That I like because it can be very frightening having a key and a book but no money and a bunch of people who are only friendly and what you to go here and there for beer, sort out this sort out that, oops here goes more money……So the Greater Path part was mine to be with. Thank you, Marshall for a most inspirational teaching…..which btw lead me into the searching through why and how ambivalence can work on both sides…of fear and how to see that there is a way out……hopefully that goes with the city too….because I’d really like to go for a beer……but afraid of where that wmll take me……and I really do not which to waste so much time on waiting……unless that is like “sitting on ambivalence” . Thanks : )
ray_Colorado:  “This is the sacred life. Anyone who has gained this and has built this will be in resonance with others who have done the same, both within this world and beyond this world. Here people from different nations and religions resonate with each other, for they are following the same Mystery. Here true relationship, association and union are experienced, beyond all the divisions, qualifications and distinctions of the world. Here you prepare through relationship to be engaged with the greater power of your life, and you find what you have always sought in engagement with others, which is purpose, meaning and direction and a deep resonance.
But you cannot build the sacred life on top of your old life. You must, like a pilgrim, seek out the sacred life and step by step build its foundation and begin to exercise its strengths, its qualities and its requirements. Here you will not settle merely for the appearance of things—spiritual ideas, trinkets or simple things—for you are seeking the…
ray_Colorado:  … deep union now.
Heaven responds to those who are building the sacred life, who have the courage, the self-honesty and the fortitude to do this. They are the ones that Heaven will attend to, for they are the ones who show promise for themselves and for the well-being of others and ultimately for the advancement of humanity.” (The Sacred Life )http://www.newmessage….-life
Adria_work:  @James,thank you, I can relate in my experience to that. Following what Knowledge indicates gives one this sense of grace and rightness.
Josef Austria:  Hello everyone!
Dariel_Boulder:  Thank you Carol.
Tyyne_Society:  “Now at the beginning, because the jungle overlays everything, the path is very subtle. Yes, you can see a stepping stone here and a stepping stone there, but it is overlaid by the jungle. But it is still discernible enough for you to take the first steps, and as you do this, you will begin a process of re-evaluation of your life, which is necessary and natural for you.” This struck me as I was listening to this over the last few days. That even though we may not have a “clear path” as we set out, we somehow, each one of us, have taken the initial steps needed to find the NM and the Messenger. Even though still overgrown in some way, it was discernible even in the beginning. That to me speaks of the power of Knowledge. The power of this golden thread that brings us to, even if just a glimmer in the beginning, who we are and why we are here, whom we must meet and what we must accomplish.
Maureen_Boulder:  The good news is that in spite of what may look like no way out, there is a “clear path” if we learn to be in touch with our “sense” of things. This feels right, this doesn’t. Steps to Knowledge is the penultimate jungle guide in helping us find this sense.
Diane S. New Mexico67759:  I agree with you Lingling…
Ellen_Society:  @Carol. …I do recognize that there are still some tendril vines wrapped around parts of me – vines left from those jungle days. At least now I can see them and work with them.
Chrysostomos:  @ Carolyn_WA , Buddhist perception.
Tonia _Denmark:  Unless° That means There is more work to do……which will be good. And needed.
Cole_Boulder:  This teaching on the jungle was powerful, though I must listen / read it again to reap its deeper wisdom. So often I feel within the jungle of the mind is a canopy that covers the sky and the sun – and yet in those moments of clarity, the light can shine through the treetops and reveal the path ahead.
Rudy_Boulder:  Finding the New Message is one of the first steps. Studying the New Message is another step. The way out of the jungle will be a life long journey, but I find it important that there is a jungle within my mind, within myself to not get caught up and lost in there too long. If I know something does not feel right, I have the power to move in a different direction within myself. “And once you begin to move in the right direction, there is a sense of rightness about your life that begins to emerge. But it doesn’t emerge completely; it still stands in contrast with all the effects of the jungle that are still within you. But you begin to feel there is a time when you are really right with yourself and a time when you are not right with yourself. “
Tyyne_Society:  @Ellen – yes, some tendrils left, but managing them now. Aware of them now. Where as in the past I/we may not even have known they were there, so covered and deep in the jungle we were.
Tuukka Finland:  I remember in my old diaries I wrote… I described my state (on one occasion) as “being in a jungle stumbling upon rollercoasters and riding them”… I even sketched a picture. Now there’s The New Message, and I know I can get out.
Douglas_St. Paul:  Acquiescing to the domination of the mind is another debilitating habit to overcome, like judgment, anxiety, assumption, ambivalence and so forth.
Tyyne_Society:  @Rudy – yes, this is a true gift what you say here: ” If I know something does not feel right, I have the power to move in a different direction within myself.”
Tonia _Denmark:  I guess for those living in the city there is a greater system from before that needs to be undone….unlearned….and a new integrated or buildt… a deconstructing and a reconstructing… a new way…..more beneficial
James_Boulder:  @ Cole yes – the enclosure of the jungle, blind to the Greater Community perspective.
11441:  Benjamin ; If I may add smthng, There are severe restrictions on understanding the world in place to stop us seeing the true situation of highly organised, drilled, crime. Such as we are “stopped” from knowing all corporations are inter-linked with only 100 people running nearly everything in every major company. We are “stopped” from knowing that there is a meeting which all presidents and CEO’s attend each year under armed secrecy. There are people who know this and can tell you about it. Getting to know the world around us is a critical way and I believe a pre-requisite, to understanding yourself. 
ray_Colorado:  “You can hear the Messenger. You can see the Messenger. You can receive the Revelation given now in the purest form imaginable. It is your challenge. It is your opportunity. It will bring to you that which lives within you, which is great.
It will show you the way out of the jungle of confusion.”
(The Journey of the Messenger) http://www.newmessage….enger
Debbie-MI:  @26610-I like the idea you mentioned of “turning our past “mistakes” into opportunities”. Mistakes can always be learning opportunities if we reflect and learn from them. The metaphor of the jungle and the “clear path” really moved me.
MaryS_Boulder:  Patricia shared these words at 47:42 of Day 11 of Steps Vigil this year. “Steps to Knowledge is the path out of the jungle.”
manuel germany :):  @Rudy_Boulder many thanks yes –
Paul_MA:  Tynne- As with a jungle, you will need to cleave the vines that are holding you back within the jungle. Some of these vines are very strong and have been growing for some time, But as you cut them, you are released to travel freely and more quickly out of the jungle.
Marianna Greece:  Yes Tyyne so powerfull
Susan_Malaysia:  Thank you, MVS for the teachings on the Jungle, it has moved me to find my right path to Knowledge.
Tonia _Denmark:  Lol thank you, Ray. The jungle of confusion. How appropriate.
Alisa_Russia:  @MaryS – thank you for that reminder. Yes, indeed it is!
Raoul_Australia:  When I found the Allies and as a result the NM I was totally into the jungle – conspiracy theories, ET channellings, misleading books, wrong aspirations etc. Something was stirring me to find a way out.
Diane S. New Mexico67759:  Yes, keeping a journal is really helping me to remember past errors and reflect on them.
Ilhun_Korea:  Thank you, MaryS. “Steps to Knowledge is the path out of the jungle.”
Jansett_KY:  @ Arthur, Good point (11:24AM EDT). Finding the New Message is like finding an indigenous scout who knows how to read the signs of the jungle, who knows which direction is the way out. You marvel at first when you catch a glimpse of what the scout is seeing, and often stumble as you “think” you’re doing the same thing. You come to realize that the indigenous scout knows the jungle completely and only when you know it will you be able to navigate it. You can learn to know it by listening to, watching and following the scout diligently, with trust and openness.
ray_Colorado:  Arthur “… from time to time we repeat certain lessons that are essential for your well-being and development. We give them different wording from time to time so that you may have a greater and greater experience of them. In this way, they may find their way into your heart … so that your heart may find its way into your consciousness. ” (Steps to Knowledge Step 185)
Angela_PA:  The Jungle teaching reminds me that it is a choice that I must make over and over again in daily life. If I stop, hesitate, allow for Knowledge, which is already present, be known to me then the way through the jungle can be shown. I have to listen inwardly even when the world around me is loud, raging and confused.
Joyanne_Canada:  thank you Jansette, great description..of the way out of the jungle.
Erik_OR:  The Jungle came at just the right time. It speaks to many of the experiences I’ve had in the past regarding which decision to make, and in discerning what I need vs. what I want, etc. When living life at the surface of the mind, things are always indistinct, changeable, unreliable, and sometimes downright scary. Returning to the deeper roots yields a completely different experience, one of clarity and calm, focused intention. One could also say it’s like looking down at the compass, rather than just flinging oneself into the underbrush.
David Drimmel:  Step 102 is my step today. How appropriate. http://stepstoknowledg…n.htm
26610:  Christopher here: Another jungle metaphor is that in permaculture understanding a jungle has 10-15 levels of habitats from life on the ground, to 15 feet up, 30 fet, 45 feet etc…all the way to the top canopy. Most of these habitats do not ineract except they are all built on the foundation on the ground. A bit like me. Fortunately the NM gives us guidelines for bottom to top living.
Tuukka Finland:  Thank you Jansett.
Robert_Society:  My impression is the jungle is much bigger than we think it is. It’s not just our ideas about the world and things…it’s our idea of “self” and all of those things that make this up. Many formed in childhood and certainly along the way reinforced. This is a life long journey out, and will take consistent and detemined effort on our part to accomplish.
Singh:  David did you experience presence of Knowledge when you were at step 50 or 51
Tonia _Denmark:  It reminds me how we back in the old days use to say take care, it’s a jungle out there. And it was! I never knew how profound those words were.
Selma Londons Jungle ;):  Christopher, jungles are also vulnerable because of their inter-dependency
Bob_CT:  Jansett – Good image. Thanks.
Inhee_Korea:  Thank you Carol, Those are important questions for me.
Jennie_Netherlands:  I want to share a story what happened last week after letting my daughter and her boyfriend hear the teaching of Greater Community Person. After the audio was finished they reflected for about half an hour that they find that teaching so relevant to their lives at this moment. They suddenly remembered why they did what they did, why they choose to to certain kind of work and what drives them. It was a miracle to experience this. I am so grateful for that experience.
Marianna Greece:  We have to make more often our hourly practise Where am I,(IN THE JUNGLE) what I am doing?(TO GO OUT)
Tonia _Denmark:  Thank you Jansett
Carol_Society:  Please feel free to continue the current discussion on The Jungle, if you wish, as we now begin to delve into the Core Revelation for Month 2 of this session: The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity. In reading this profound revelation, what has impacted you most?
Tyyne_Society:  @Paul @Marianna Yes, it is important to tend to and maintain the pathway. The Great Practices and Steps to Knowledge and the body of teachings given by the Messenger. Immersion into this is something that keeps coming back to me about practice. I/we have been pretty immersed in the jungle and now there is the way through and out leading to service and less preoccupation with things that really don’t matter.
Joyanne_Canada:  @Robert, similar impression, it will take a lifetime to journey out,, so many levels and layers to separation that need to be navigated, we just need to keep Stepping on out of this jungle by applying our preparation, every expanding our understanding and perspectives.
Keiko_Ita:  I have been reading here and there comments on Chat…I have just remembered the phrase MVS said in the video “The blessing of your life” if I remember well. He said, “I MUST I MUST, otherwise Heaven can not hear you.” This is the key to call the Unseen Ones to come to you. I will not forget this.
Erik_OR:  @Robert, agreed, it is indeed a lifelong journey. No easy fix here!
David Drimmel:  @Singh – Various times, yes. Also, in other times in my life I have experienced the presence of God and knowledge that permeated my mind an being.
Diane S. New Mexico67759:  Yes, there is definitely a jungle on Facebook , but I sift through it and focus on what I know to be real to me. I am thankful for finding the New Message and having the opportunity to take the Steps to Knowledge and practice everyday. It is keeping me focused on what is really important now.
Tom_SanFrancisco:  I remember learning that the word “jungle” originally meant the tangle of growth outside the edge of a cleared forest (typically a tropical forest). with that in mind the analogy is perfect because the jungle is not the primordial self (forest) but a response to the activities of human culture.
Singh:  Thanks for your answer
Raoul_Australia:  Thank you for sharing that, Jennie, that is wonderful!
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ Carol To be true to myself is a necessity to see the truth.
And look within yourself—not to what you think and believe, but deeper, into your deeper mind, into the mind of what is truly known within you. Here you will find the substantiation as well, for what is most true within you is connected to what is most true outside of you, just as what is untrue or false within you is connected to what is untrue and false outside of you.
Tonia _Denmark:  As soon as one looses the balance in life, trees are everywhere! Path no where. And this! The book is providing us the means to get back into balance and See the path. God bless the AA and the Creator.
Tom_SanFrancisco:  the jungle for me is the tangle of what i call chronic thought and the identification with “the thinker”. the machete is sharpened through meditation.
Alison_Boulder:  @Carol, regarding question #2, although I am not out of the jungle on this one, I will say this quote from The Great Challenge resonates with me in how I can describe the New Life. Before: Let problems get really bad. After: At the very least, see them and begin to chop vines: 
“Whereas the man or woman of Knowledge seeks to eliminate the problem once it is first recognized, the person without this great foundation will allow things to deteriorate and then will make drastic efforts to address it, often without good results.”
ray_Colorado:  ““God has given you a way out of the jungle. God has given you the resolution to the crisis. But you must live the resolution. You must act upon it. It is not merely a moment of self-realization. You must serve because that is why you have come. That is the purpose God has given you—a very specific purpose to give in a certain way, to certain people and situations. You are perfectly designed for this.
You do not heal the crisis by having a new understanding or a better point of view or a spiritual answer for everything. It is embarking on a new life guided by Knowledge that brings the great resolution to your life.
Now your life is not based on fear and preference, and a desperate attempt to satisfy your unquenchable thirst for excitement or avoidance. The deeper pain within you can only be resolved by the gift of purpose and meaning that Knowledge within you carries for you, waiting to be discovered.
To live a life of compassion and service is something that is so remarkable. Yet you…
ray_Colorado:  … will still suffer for the conditions of the world, you will fear for the safety of others, and you will have trial and difficulty along the way. But that is life itself here. The difference is that the crisis will be over within you, not all at once, but incrementally, … as you continue to follow the true and clear path.
You must demonstrate the greater life to others and to yourself. It is you who must be convinced.
Those who watch over you know who you are, … but you do not know this yet.” ( The Crisis )http://www.newmessage….risis
Insuk_Korea:  Thank you MaryS for “Steps to Knowledge is the path out of the jungle.”
MaryL_Boulder:  @Arthur: “Finding the New Message is not equivalent to having found your way out of the jungle.” True. Finding the NM may just be the light that we can focus upon but the work remains for us to do. The thicket is forever growing around us, seducing to remain asleep or just following the world and as for as the internal jungle of the mind, the thoughts, habitual fantasies and secret desires will continue to haunt us as long as we allowed them. Without the daily practices, hourlies, our own discipline as well as the relationships we have with other students who are stronger than we – the internal jungle will forever encased us even if we call ourselves students of Knowledge. I find I am never out of this jungle but I can recognize it and when needed see the way to taking a step further towards the light of Knowledge.
Val_Westport:  Fortunately, Robert, Knowledge also, is much bigger than we think it is…
Tonia _Denmark:  Thanks Alison. Know where we are now. ( question2)
Keiko_Ita:  He said also “Vital necessity”
Jeffrey_Boulder:  resonating for me from “The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity”: “…what is most true within you is connected to what is most true outside of you, just as what is untrue or false within you is connected to what is untrue and false outside of you.”
Lin_Boulder:  @Robert, so true. What is staying with me is instead of struggling in the jungle, how to put the mind in constructive use, either contemplation or critical thinking and problem solving, or simply being still and alert. That in itself is a great learning and practice.
Erik_OR:  @Tom, I like the “machete” analogy here. Vajrayana Buddhism in the Himalayas often identifies a “vajra sword” or “sword of wisdom” in its iconography. Sometimese we really do have to “cut through” the undergrowth of confusion!
Amina Russia:  2.In reading the revelation The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity, this probably impacted me most:2.It is incredible that people are not free, but they think they are free….. if you cannot see what is happening in the world around you, in the bigger picture beyond your own little personal sphere; if you cannot see these things and feel these things, you are not yet free…Humanity does not simply prepare. It is the individuals who prepare….You must find the middle ground. This is where clarity is achieved. This is where balance exists. It is not running from one set of emotions or expectations to another. It is finding the middle ground. This is following The Way of Knowledge, for Knowledge is not captivated by promises of hope and prosperity and happiness. And Knowledge is not captivated by the dark [draw] of fear or the attractions of anxiety.
manuel germany :):  thank you Jennie_Netherlands. moving experience, thank you for sharing.
Mathieu_France:  @Raoul: I think that’s where many of us were looking at the beginning, not because we were so strongly resonating with that kind of foreign teachings or all-conspiracy currents, but because there was a stir calling us out of our “normal lives” calling us on a real pathway to find what we were meant to find. No so many of us have directly identifying that inner stir at the outset as “a New Message from God”, right? I’m pretty convinced that many of these confusing temples in that jungle are populated by people that are in fact looking for something else, but who don’t know yet what… May we find them.
Jim B. Upstate NY:  In my sobriety every step every choice I made either got me closer to a drink and farther away from sobriety or closer to sobriety and farther away from a drink. The NM I feel works in a similar manner. Every choice I make every action I take either gets me closer to Knowledge or farther away from it. The choice is always mine.
Betty_UK:  Hi Ayesha, Marshall’s teaching The Jungle, I could recognise where I’ve been and some part I’m still struggling, but it also gave me a clearer indication on the contrast between following Knowledge or other things. The Knowledge sign posts, this contrast is becoming more clearer I feel.
Marianna Greece:  Yes Robert the jungle is bigger specially, our inner jungle. I am doing for second time the Steps, and I found the Way of Knowledge 2003 and still I am still beginer.
Paul_MA:  What stood out:…Many things, but Three Passages really stood out above the rest, the first….
“Here it is essential to realize that what the great Teachers provided millennia ago cannot be sufficient to meet a new set of circumstances. That is why the evolution of religion constitutes a successive wave of new Revelations……happens every century/millennium. And they occur to meet the changing circumstances of life & to prepare for the future.”
This one too resonated within me: “Humanity is way behind schedule in it preparation for the Greater Community. It was hoped by the greater Spiritual Forces that are overseeing the well-being of humanity that more progress would have been made. But humanity is lagging.”
Reed_Society:  @Mary, thank you ” I definitely felt the world was an overwhelming jungle of confusion and misery and my internal world was a jungle as well so I withdrew and tried to create my own internal world of order…making people and things good/bad/right/wrong.” It is interesting how judgement comes hand-in-hand with being lost. The jungle is a dynamic environment, so many people, so many forces, and if our connection to Knowledge – the guide, the compass – is severed and we are lost in that dynamic environment, we pull in and try to make what is dynamic into something static, a cached image of a dynamic world, judgement forms the walls of our self-protection, people become objects in our space, objects to have or to avoid, the dynamic reality becomes a static photograph in the mind’s eye and, being unhitched from reality, leads to many mistakes in relationships and life decisions. Without Knowledge, the Jungle compels us to building defenses or delusions, self-made path that ultimately fails…
Reed_Society:  … us, and then the opportunity to know and return to our guide and compass presents itself, and in time we can return to the jungle of the world participate there but in a new way, part of a “a greater force for good in the world”
Jeffrey_Boulder:  and: The man and woman of Knowledge “stand over the fulcrum of balance, and they look, and they discern.”
ray_Colorado:  “Face this and you will realize you have work to do. It is the unfinished business of your life. It is the one thing that can restore you and free you from the crisis. Failure here has great consequence. Your life will be forfeited. It will be empty. The world will not be served. And your gifts will not be given where they were meant to be given. When you return to your Spiritual Family, you will see very clearly that you did not make the connection. There will be no condemnation there, but there will be the perfect Knowledge that you must return and try again.” (The Crisis) http://www.newmessage….risis
Raoul_Australia:  @Mathieu, yes, absolutely! “many of these confusing temples in that jungle are populated by people that are in fact looking for something else”, a good call to advocate and continue our work for the NM
Michael_Boulder:  @Alison I notice that everything can follow from a small step forward.
Carol_Society:  @Shrimayi: when I read this passage, I paused on the word “substantiation.” One definition: “to give substantial existence to: to substantiate an idea through action.” In other words, to take action on what you truly know.
Aurora_Hawaii:  @Amina – that passage struck me as well.
Joyanne_Canada:  The Jungle made me recognize that Separation is bigger and deeper than I thought. It made me reevaluate my understanding of the Jungle in the mind.. and made me realize I have much to learn as I navigate this jungle within. I am grateful for the Steps to Knowledge, and the Messenger who blazed this trail
Jorge_Spain:  “Where do you see, in all the bright and dismal prospects for the future, any mention of the Greater Community, any mention that humanity’s age-old isolation is coming to an end? People are still thinking in a state of isolation. They are projecting their ideas, their beliefs and their aspirations within a state of isolation.” (The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity)
Rudy_Boulder:  As with a person that traverses the jungle, moments of rest are necessary. One must carry a sharp knife to cut through the thickness of the jungle to clear a path. Wisdom must be attained of what dangers are within the jungle. Let Knowledge be the sharp knife that guides us through this journey along the way. Stop and rest and resharpen the tools needed to continue along the way, to make the pass through this life as meaningful as possible.
MaryS_Boulder:  Ray, I am enjoying the pure existential pragmatism of the New Message from God that you are highlighting this morning.
Erik_OR:  @Paul, I can certainly sense this lag, not only in society at large, but occasionally within myself, returning to the choice between Knowledge and confusion, hope/fear and a greater inner direction, what I want vs what I need, etc. Humanity at large is on the path of choosing..
Kari_H_Finland:  “It [the Greater Community] puts everyone in the world in the same boat—rich or poor. No matter what country you are from, you are faced with the same problem. This equalizes the inequities that exist and provides a foundation for cooperation that simply did not exist substantially enough before.” A foundation for cooperation that simply did not exist substantially before. This opportunity for humanity has been mentioned many times in the NMG but now it really struck me. Without the Greater Community we would not have a foundation for cooperation.
Betty_UK:  I also realise that Knowledge is what I’ve been looking for, and now I must recognise and follow it’s expression.
Alisa_Russia:  @Jim – I resonate with that. It is either, or. No third way. You do it or you don’t.
Diane S. New Mexico67759:  Yes , the Stillness Practice is one of the daily practices that is helping me clear my path in the jungle.
Alexandra_NL:  @Jansett @[email protected] This bring up the practice of ALERTNESS, which I feel the revelation The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity is urging us to apply as women and men of Knowledge: “One of the most profound and important aspects in all of your education, regardless of what you do in life, is alertness. It seems so commonplace that no one thinks of it when they talk about personal development, spiritual training and so forth.” Ch. Disappointment, Wisdom I
Cole_Boulder:  Encountering this passage from ‘The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity’ was very poignant for me: “..what is most true within you is connected to what is most true outside of you, just as what is untrue or false within you is connected to what is untrue and false outside of you.” This is an insight I have arrived at in my own experience and have been trying to work with for a while as I get lost within the jungle of my own thinking and the thinking of others.
Paul_MA:  “The reality of the Greater Community (GC), the need to create a GC understanding/perspective & the need to learn GC Spirituality are the very things that will provide the foundation for cooperation for humanity. …….grave threat,…also that you have now the opportunity to develop the foundation that will solve most of t
he world’s problems & will enable you to deal with the greater problems that are awaiting humanity in its emergence into a GC life.”
Mike_LF_CAL:  @Jennie (8:36), you as so fortunate that your daughter was actually open and willing to listen to a NM Revelation, I would give mu right arm for my two daughters to be open to listen to even one recorded Revelation.
Tom_SanFrancisco:  @ paul: about 15 years ago a friend was fasting and meditating on a secluded beach. he said a guy came to him and announced that he would have a visitor, then another guy cam walking down the beach and came up to him and began ranting about all the problems humans are causing in the environment, and that all we can do about it is offer the choice of paper or plastic. “paper or plastic? is that the best you can do?” my friend says the thinks it was an angel, angry at humanity for lagging
Jorge_Spain:  “Only what you can bring forward that will be helpful will be part of your future. Everything else, stage by stage, bit by bit, will be left behind. This is your challenge.” (The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity)
MVS Society:  As you move out of the jungle of your mind, you are still faced with a world of people who are lost in that Jungle. What you bring to them is the degree of freedom, clarity and power you have regained so far. This will naturally emerge from you in your engagement with the world. You do not need to teach it.
Carol_Society:  @Paul. Oh, yes, “humanity is lagging.” And this: Even though “humanity has always been furthered by the determined effort of a small percentage of its populations. What furthers humanity is men and women of good will and true inspiration joining together to carry out important tasks to meet problems that are existing and to prepare for problems that are emerging on the horizon”….YET this Core Revelation also tells us: “The torch of truth is being carried by individuals who are ignited with the truth, but their numbers, though growing, are still not strong and great enough.”
Marianna Greece:  For many of us the journey was very long and painful, but always we had that sense of unsatisfied. Our soul was still searching for something real. We found NM, but we have to practise and unlearn because the weeds are very powerful and grown very quicly.
ray_Colorado:  “This is the beginning of a great multi-generational work to bring humanity into the Greater Community.” Reed Summers, … ” YOU HAVE COME INTO THE WORLD at a great turning point, a turning point only part of which you will see in your own lifetime.” (Steps to Knowledge Step 190) The world is emerging into the Greater Community of Worlds and that is why I have come.
Jennie_Netherlands:  @Mike, also that takes time. When they are desperate enough with their lives, they become open to hear about The New Message Revelations
Erik_OR:  Thank you, Marshall. I feel this is confirming.
MaryS_Boulder:  @Carol, “substantive change” comes up if you truncate (naturally) “substant*”
Keiko_Ita:  We need the power of Knowledge to find the way-out from the jungle…. We need the support from Heaven.
Alison_Boulder:  @MaryL you said something important about being around people who are stronger than you. Without taking that challenge, we are reinforcing a jungle environment of the same thoughts, agreement and similar struggles, with no one taking the lead –even if the lead you need is just a demonstration.
Jansett_KY:  @Erik_OR: appreciating your vajra sword reference…
jeanine_Society:  “I must experience my True Home while I am in the world.” – Step 354
Cameron_Canada:  In life, even when we are able to escape the jungle, do we ever really completely leave? Is the jungle also not our place of service? So while we may be able to free ourselves from the restrictions this place creates, so long as we are here in this world, the jungle remains as service requires.
Jennie_Netherlands:  @Keiko, I started praying again and found it miraculous that my prayers were being heard and being solved through people coming to me with a solution or I “heard” the solution.
Ilhun_Korea:  @MVS, Thank you for your clarity.
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ Carol thank you it is about to take action of what you deeply feel is true.
Javier S. Fl:  @Reed ” people become objects in our space, objects to have or to avoid”. Sometimes a struggle to remove those people and when they are not allowing others of the same makeup to fill that space.
ray_Colorado:  MaryS_Boulder: “You must prepare. Let Knowledge motivate you. Let your deeper sense of what is right and correct motivate you. Nothing is being asked of you except to receive the gift of Knowledge that is being given to your world through this Teaching. We honor the one who has received us who has made this possible for you. However, this is a gift that must also be given by you. Do not exploit it. Do not try to use it for your personal advantage. Do not try to become a master and appoint yourself the right to interpret the Greater Community Way of Knowledge for others unless we have given you this right. To achieve this you must be very advanced, … which you are not.
Remember, we are the Unseen Ones, and this gift we give to serve you, to prepare you, to enable you and to direct you because God is at work in the world.”
( GCS.15 Who Serves Humanity? ) http://www.newmessage….anity
Arthur:  @Alison You here this often in the NM “being around people who are stronger than you”, I always wondered what the strongest then do?
Joyanne_Canada:  @Ray, Reeds email struck me too.. Mulit-generational work, it expanded my understanding of the New Message in our world, and of our work here at this time, at the humble beginnings. It also made me realize what a great task the Messenger, the Society and the WWC have before us. Mulit-generational..
Aurora_Hawaii:  @MVS – Wonderful. As in “Be Examples”
Val_Westport:  I’m appreciative of your comment, Marshall; it shows how to be with those who don’t seem to have affinity or tolerance for where one is coming from or for what is the real theme of one’s life. Thank you.
Tonia _Denmark:  Regarding question 2, The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity iss definately one of my favorite revelations too. So much to talk about. The part about what is fantasy? stood out, which really is one of my newest topics to be with. Also what is propelling? stood out. This leads me to energy and the use of electricity and how looking at screens affects us and impacts us in a superficious way……the part about is humanity alone in the world? still puzzles me……which is what? The world within, the world beyond? I just can’ t seem to grasp anything about little green marsmen….so have to start within….I like the revelation because it gives an overlay like a view……like a table cloth…..and that is what stands apart for me……that there is a difference to the revelations….I think……just a thought…..some are good for speaking, some are good for listening, some are good for a later comprehension, a even bigger pitcture to come…
Alison_Boulder:  @Rudy, thanks for the note on axe sharpening. From the story of the woodcutter, I do not want to arrive at the end to my Teachers and say “Sharpen? I had no time to sharpen my axe. I have been very busy trying to cut trees…”
Reed_Society:  @Rudy, “you begin to feel there is a time when you are really right with yourself and a time when you are not right with yourself.” MVS. In my early years as a student, this sense of “feeling right with myself” was my primary compass, my primary way of knowing where to go and not go, it was so simple, like a two direction pressure gauge within me, I simply felt a rightness to my life, or a growing “wrongness,” keeping it this simple helped me, instead of entertaining ideas of complete transformation, of awakening, of levels of awareness, it was a simple pressure gauge within me, unignorable, this helped me to develop a sense of what Knowledge felt like and didn’t feel like. I think for all students it is helpful to label this feeling within themselves, yes/no, go/stop, rightness or wrongness, however you label the pressure gauge within, can help make very simple and direct your recognition of Knowledge and the essential truth that “yes, this is correct, proceed” or “no, i don’t feel…
Reed_Society:  … right about this thing, this decision, this direction i’m taking, I must stop.”
Alisa_Russia:  I think the hardest part for most people is looking beyond this lifetime.
Cole_Boulder:  @Reed thank you
Tonia _Denmark:  Question 2) “Only what you can bring forward that will be helpful will be part of your future.” Thats the one still hanging in there today.
Marianna Greece:  Bu t we have to be stable.As you move out of the jungle of your mind, you are still faced with a world of people who are lost in that Jungle. What you bring to them is the degree of freedom, clarity and power you have regained so far. This will naturally emerge from you in your engagement with the world. You do not need to teach it.(6:47PM)
MaryS_Boulder:  Arthur, to contemplate on what the strongest do is good contemplation.
Keiko_Ita:  You trust them, they lead to the pathway….so you show your real intention to get out of it. You need the courage to do this. You pray it is like a vital necessity in your life. It is necessary. indeed.
Erik_OR:  Thank you, Reed. These ideas remind me of a very important teaching which I was exposed to in the early days of the New Message, back when I first encountered Marshall’s teachings. One teaching, a talk, was called “Resonance,” and if I recall correctly, this was the central idea. It helped hone my own compass.
Paul_MA:  Carol-resonating about individuals .” Humanity is made up of individuals, and humanity has always been furthered by the determined effort of a small percentage of its population…..Humanity does not simply prepare. It is the individuals who prepare.”….
manuel germany :):  @Reed_Society. thank you so much for sharing your experiences – I resonate very much with them
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @MVS thank you “You do not need to teach it”
Alisa_Russia:  @Paul, I am resonating with that as well.
Joyanne_Canada:  @Reed thank you … a Barometer, compass to assist us in gauging where we are..
Tuukka Finland:  Thank you Reed. People as objects… It is so easy to do this. And as a result there’s no connection.
Betty_UK:  Thank you Marshall @9:47 “As you move out of the jungle of your mind, you are still faced with a world of people who are lost in that Jungle. What you bring to them is the degree of freedom, clarity and power you have regained so far. This will naturally emerge from you in your engagement with the world. You do not need to teach it.”
Mike_LF_CAL:  @Paul, (8:42) , “…That is why the evolution of religion constitutes a successive wave of new Revelations…” that passage stood out very strongly fro me as well.
Reed_Society:  @Erik thank you for that image, stopping to look down at the compass, vs throw ourselves into the underbrush
Carol_Society:  A resounding call from The Greater Challenge: Do not say, “Somebody should do something about this!” It is you. The calling is for you. The calling is for anyone who can respond, and who can prepare, and who can accept the challenge, and who can meet the responsibilities. Yes, they are great, but this is the way you find greatness within yourself. You never find greatness living a little life preoccupied with little things. You find a greater life by taking on a greater challenge and responsibility, by calling upon a greater power and energy within yourself and by staying with it and moving through the thresholds of learning, developing your skills and your awareness.

Maureen_Boulder:  Manipulation is in the air. “Day by day the evidence grows. Day by day more people are becoming aware. But there is still tremendous ignorance and denial. There is still tremendous manipulation of the evidence. It is very hard for people to gain any reliable information now.”

“The answer is both outside of you and within you, not just one or the other. You must look into the world, at the greater movement of the world. “

….“You must look into the world with new eyes, not with eyes of hope and longing, not with eyes of fear and trepidation, but look to see what is there, to take the time and the energy to really look and see what is there. “

Aurora_Hawaii:  @Reed, I have felt the same, and it is linked to “feelings” to me, so I get a bit concerned when someone speaks of “controlling” feelings.
mellany:  Thank you, Jeanine … yes! “only those who know that they have come from their Ancient Home can give. If you do not know you have a Home beyond the world, how can you give?”
MVS Society:  To move freely in and out of the jungle both within yourself and within the world, you cannot be bound to it. You have to know it is not who you are. It becomes the environment in which you serve.
Raoul_Australia:  At one point, when I was still lost in the jungle, the word ‘knowledge’ would jump at me anytime I ran into it, in any of the books I was reading, so when STK miraculously appeared I knew it was the answer – the pathway through the jungle.
justin-calif-!:  Have to run, gang- Will be on Venice beach shortly with another of our group giving out info today- stay safe, all! NNC, j
manuel germany :):  Thank you so much Carol_Society for sharing that quote. It is for us to respond and not the neighbor.
11441:  Benjamin ; I think this is the method by which our world is being changed for/by the “Visitors”..,,,,, False Flag Terror attacks, have you noticed? London terror attacks were done by crisis actors, no-one is killed or injured. I am thinking Las Vegas is total fake,,, Good news! No-one died. At least there is that, this is done to politically motivate people to change gun laws in USA.
Lin_Boulder:  Thank you, MVS. ” it is not who you are.”
Ayesha_Society:  @Reed, Feeling right or not right being the compass towards a direction. I remember there was no escaping this for me. When it felt right there was an experience of grace at times as James described . When I was off track, it was a sense of ill at ease that nothing can allay. For me this experience of “Knowledge” was not profound insight, or big visions. It was more a push towards, or a pull and the back and forth of currents in the ocean. This is where I’m beginning to put my trust in the evidence in Knowledge moving towards a direction not of my own making.
Cameron_Canada:  Thank you MVS – That is what I was trying say.
Tuukka Finland:  Thank you Marshall.
Shane – New Zealand:  Thank you @Marshall
Russell_Sask:  Okay Students of Knowledge time to practice what you preach. How about a round of Stillness at the upcoming Top of the Hour. Step away from the enter button for one minute I double Dog Dare you…
Erik_OR:  @Marshall, In the world but not of the world.
Lingling_Boulder:  @Mary “I find I am never out of this jungle but I can recognize it …..” yes, it is very impotant to recognize i am in the jungle and what the jungle is, otherwise I will not have desire to find a way. I thought I was on the big road but in reality not, ignorant. I remember someone said ” the person who doesn’t move doesn’t know he/she has a chain. So if I don’t look around and don’t move, I don’t know the things and people I am stuck in. I am so gateful that I found NM.
Joyanne_Canada:  resonating Ayesha
Alisa_Russia:  I am becoming more and more aware that you have to have a certain background, a certain history to be able to do what the Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity asks for. Looking into the world for signs, looking into yourself, working with the deeper mind are things that we all accept and are familiar with, but I have found that most people want facts and science-based statistics. I see the challenge we are up against.
ray_Colorado:  “You must find the middle ground. This is where clarity is achieved. This is where balance exists. It is not running from one set of emotions or expectations to another. It is finding the middle ground. This is following The Way of Knowledge, for Knowledge is not captivated by promises of hope and prosperity and happiness. And Knowledge is not captivated by the dark [draw] of fear or the attractions of anxiety.
Fear is easy. It takes very little effort to experience it. Optimism is a little harder, but it too is easy because you can fill your mind with wonderful expectations and tell yourself all kinds of things about reality around you and within you. But Knowledge is harder. Finding the balance point is more difficult. It requires determination, effort and preparation.” (The Great Challenge Awaiting Humanity)
11441:  Maureen Boulder Yes, definitely 
Tonia _Denmark:  Carol, I say that to the cash lady in the supermarket. We laugh about something silly and I say well you know there is only us humans to change it. They pause for a second or so and either withdraw….too deep a thoght perhaps…or they smile and go yes you are right.
Aurora_Hawaii:  Thank you Carol! It’s similar to a situation at work: The printer toner needs changing – who’s to do it? I guess I found it, tag, I’m it! lol
Marianna Greece:  You have to know it is not who you are. It becomes the environment in which you serve.(6:57PM) Sorry I didnt understand the last sentence.
Diane S. New Mexico67759:  we need to respond from a place deep within ourselves…
Val_Westport:  Another so valuable insight to remember, Marshall. Perhaps a milepost of maturity will be when I don’t have to remember that this is the world I’ve come to serve, serving it will simply be a function of who I am.
Ayesha_Society:  We are past the hour, lets take a moment of stillness in gratitude for this preparation sent by the Creator, down to our Messenger, into our hands now. Humanity has not been forgotten, and may we prepare to be the men and women of Knowledge that we are meant to be. May the innate strength of humanity come forth. The world is calling and needs this of many people now.
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ another part that impacted me . Oh yes you cannot do this for yourself you do not have the capacity. But doing this for humanity you have the capacity.
Only what you can bring forward that will be helpful will be part of your future. Everything else, stage by stage, bit by bit, will be left behind. This is your challenge. You do not do this only for yourself. You do it for humanity. For yourself alone, you will not mount the effort; you will not make the commitment; you will not face the difficulties and the uncertainties. But for humanity, there is a greater calling and a greater responsibility.
Tom_SanFrancisco:  @ ray: Herman Hesse’s Sidhartha
Jansett_KY:  “The God of the Greater Community requires a deep resonance, and this resonance happens at the level of Knowledge. Resonance is not the same as understanding, intellectual understanding. It is more of a deep experience of affinity, of relationship, of being related. No one’s intellect in the world and no one’s intellect even in the Greater Community can encompass the meaning of this. But the experience is available, and it is there.” Life in the Universe, Chapter 13.
ray_Colorado:  “You are meant to live a sacred life—a life of purpose, meaning and direction. But the world is a hazardous place, and many people do not have the opportunity to assume a greater life due to poverty and oppression, religious oppression and family obligations. But for those who have this opportunity available to them at this moment, the calling is there, you see. The desire is there within you.
The Will of Heaven is all around you, but the world has many attractions, seductions and distractions. People are called away, and as is so often the case, they give their life away prematurely—in relationships, bonding themselves to people, places and things. This fills up the need temporarily, the need for the sacred life.” (The Sacred Life)http://www.newmessage….-life
Tyyne_Society:  @Carol @Shrimayi – and this too… “You find a greater life by taking on a greater challenge and responsibility, by calling upon a greater power and energy within yourself and by staying with it and moving through the thresholds of learning, developing your skills and your awareness.”
Kari_H_Finland:  Once again I was reminded to have forbearance. “Often people want the result: “Well, I just want to know what my purpose is, and I will do it. Maybe.” They do not want to go through the process of finding out, which is the critical thing. They just want to have the answer. They want to have the result. So they give themselves the answer… They cannot make a commitment to anything, for they have no foundation to make a commitment upon. And so today they firmly want this, but next week, well, it changes. And then a month later it is something else. And they cannot become focused, and they cannot choose a direction and move there clearly with wisdom and discernment.” Forbearance [patient self-control, restraint and tolerance].
Chrysostomos:  Yesterday i found a trick for not my mind travels around the globe with unseen speeds. i forbidden him from travelling. He stayed much longer with me than anytime before. Today i will issue him a passport and he will apply for visa as well, anytime he wants to travel.
Lin_Boulder:  “Here you must lead yourself. And as you lead yourself, there are greater forces that will lead you. Amazingly, as you begin to yield to this greater power, you yourself are able to finally gain control of your mind and your emotions in a healthy way, in a way with certainty and compassion. Finally, you can determine what you think and where your mind will go and what you will choose with greater clarity now, which was not really possible before.” -from “Suffering”
Paul_MA:  Amnesia of the Greater Community: Looking for guidance asto how to get past this Amnesia that I have of my connection to the Greater Community? Have others felt this amnesia too?
Aurora_Hawaii:  @1141 – Definitely. I have started casually asking my associates if they know what “False Flag” means. No? I liken it to the World Trade Canter, and the latest response was”it was an inside job”. Just to open eyes of mainstream fed folks a little at a time…..
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ Yes Tynne as also this You do not do this only for yourself. You do it for humanity. For yourself alone, you will not mount the effort; you will not make the commitment; you will not face the difficulties and the uncertainties. But for humanity, there is a greater calling and a greater responsibility.
Lingling_Boulder:  @MVS”You have to know it is not who you are. It becomes the environment in which you serve.” yes, so strongly speak to my heart.
Tonia _Denmark:  I still need to find the middle way….instead of rushing to oh that looks good, or no, no, not that way……but the world within world within has super much power on me……like strings attached in my body, pulling me miles and miles to one side and back again……just want to unplug in the weekends were it is worst.
Tyyne_Society:  Thank you to all for joining in this great movement in the world and for joining the community of givers supporting the New Message from God. Thank you deeply. Today there are 91 Pillars and 50 Friends of the New Message. Consider becoming a Pillar or a Friend today: http://www.newmessage….ssage
Adria_work:  @Tyyne thank you for this quote.
Virgie_near Seattle:  @Arthur: with whom do the strongest spend time: this week I was considering how little of the Presence I can stand and how long and how deeply the Messenger has stood in the Presence of the Assembly … and it just seems so far beyond my understanding that a human being could do such a thing.
ray_Colorado:  “Your relationship with Knowledge represents your relationship with God. This is how God speaks to you and you may not hear this as a voice maybe a feeling an image a sound a voice. People experience the power and presence of Knowledge differently according to the individual orientations but the truth remains that there is a greater agenda within you a greater power within you and it will provide the real relationships for you the relationships of destiny.
It will provide the true work and engagement in the world for you it will give you power that the world does not understand power that comes from within rather than that is placed upon you from without.
This is what liberates you from confusion from ambivalence condemnation self-hatred and self-limiting beliefs and attitudes and habits for if you follow this all the way everything that is not true will be revealed to you and will fall away in time. Everything that does represent your true life your greater life and your greater…
ray_Colorado:  … purpose for being here will be revealed and tend will to fall away. (21:59)
You will still be a person with weaknesses and unhealthily attractions perhaps you will still be fallible and you will not be perfect you will not be all powerful but you will be following something that is all powerful that will give you strength and confidence and will keep you from harming yourself and harming others.
You are connecting yourself now to something of the most importance that is central to your life That is fulfilling the deeper needs of your soul. You are still a person you are still fallible you still have your weaknesses and your idiosyncrasies but there is something else about you a presence a power a commitment to life a focus an integrity that will impress and inspire others.
When someone has great presence this is particularly what it means it is not the force of their personality it is not their self-assertion or the will power it is the presence that is with them.
The presence of…
ray_Colorado:  … Knowledge the deeper mind within them has now become predominate and the intellect their personal worldly mind is following and serving this greater power within them.” (Following the Presence) https://newknowledgeli…load/
Alisa_Russia:  @Paul – yes, it is hard to remember, but it is possible to get some glimpses now and again. I sometimes remember things during Stillness.

Alison_Boulder:  One way to assist the Society in advocating for the New Message this week is sharing “The Jungle” video. Who is waiting to be recognized out in the world, searching on the internet for truth and resonance?

Subscribe, comment and like the video on Youtube:…=256s

Share it from the MVS Facebook page into groups with large numbers of members:

manuel germany :):  There is no 7th cavalry. We are the 7th cavalry if you will. God is not going to save the world 5 minutes to midnight. God has sent us to do the job. We are here to work. So does God work in the universe, through sentient beings from the inside out. We are vehicles for the expression of Knowledge in the world. Through our experiences and interactions with the world we are giving our gifts to the needy world. And so we are smoothen the pathway for other people and future generations.
Reed_Society:  @MVS Thank you “What you bring to them is the degree of freedom, clarity and power you have regained so far. This will naturally emerge from you in your engagement with the world. You do not need to teach it.” I think of the trap of trying to make things happen, instead of seeing what is happening and letting a response arise naturally, if it arises at all. It is the trap of trying too hard to make something happen.
Tonia _Denmark:  Thank you again, Ray.
Russell_Sask:  And so it seems time to depart for the hour has come and gone and thusly the world calls me to serve up something interesting…Hhumm Nope nothing comes to mind
Patricia_Society:  @Jansett_Ky “You come to realize that the indigenous scout knows the jungle completely and only when you know it will you be able to navigate it.” Part of our study is “the jungle.” The New Message is continually citing in its revelations, clearly the features of our collective and individual condition-habits of mind and body, moods, tendencies, be they social and anti-social, be they individually based or of group mind. This is the “landscape of the onshore reality” where we will go to serve, where we will spend an enormous amount of our time and focus there. Yet amidst the hacking, and cluttered vision, and barely discernable path, we have the opportunity to find that place of quiet within us, right there. To go “offshore” even in the jungle. To find that navigational signal within and beyond us. Right there….right in the jungle. And if ever to encounter another in that jungle, with a similar look in their eye…who may even go on to express clearly and coherently what moves and…
Patricia_Society:  … guides them, to exchange a moment with them like this, oh, is an offshore/onshore gift….And on you will go on, guided by the intermittent signal, now becoming more resident in your mind and body, applying the hard earned lifelong wisdoms of the trail, as you help and you serve here and there…Thank you all so much for taking into yourselves the enormous wisdoms and truths Marshall has devoted his life to bringing to you, through this New Message from God….
Alison_Boulder:  And Advocacy Gatherings meet every Thursday at — a great way to become involved in working with the needs of the New Message to reach the world! Email [email protected] for help and details, or show up at 6:30pm MDT or 7pm BST to Uberconference.
Rudy_Boulder:  Thanks for the pressure gauge analogy, Reed. This yes/no, feels right/does not feel right, looks easy on paper, but harder to carry out in life. I was talking to a student yesterday and I mentioned that certain situations are good for practicing compassion, understanding, patience, which seems easy to do, but to put them into practice, while being frustrated, angry, overwhelmed, it is so much harder to do. As with your pressure gauge, it needs to be put into practice to be effective. This yes/no approach needs to be practiced over time or it never builds strength, just as compassion, patience and understanding need to be practiced. Things will always look good on paper, unless practiced consistently and with intention.
Cole_Boulder:  I feel that the Greater Darkness in the world is casting its shadow in such a way that the jungle within people grows darker, more entrenched and ensnared and confusing. Only a Revelation from God could provide the power and light that could pierce the forces we are up against.
Tuukka Finland:  Thank you Reed and Marshall.
Betty_UK:  I look forward to fully serve in this way – Thank you Lingling and Marshall at “To move freely in and out of the jungle both within yourself and within the world, you cannot be bound to it. You have to know it is not who you are. It becomes the environment in which you serve”
James_Boulder:  The importance of self knowledge is highlighted here for me today. We must know the jungle terrain both within and in the world, not so that we can attempt the impossible of resolving, untangling, fixing… but so that we can know the contrast and within contract is the most powerful force given to our personal side… choice… it is in this recognition that we choose to follow Something Else.
Ayesha_Society:  I don’t think we are anywhere close to near the end! Thanks for your active participation, the enthusiasm and inspiration you bring here. Please continue to share if you wish, otherwise see you next week same time ad place. Take care, NNC
Carol_Society:  We would like to offer again these recent opportunities to engage with the Messenger:
The Messenger Speaks: The Jungle…CU_RU
The Messenger Speaks: Being a Greater Community Person…2jhqUThe Messenger Interview: The Great Waves Prophecy and the Alien Intervention…

The following resources for study and connection with other students:
>The Allies of Humanity Forum: http://alliesofhumanit…orum/
>Campfire Chat Transcriptions: http://www.newmessage….ripts
Today’s Chat transcript will be posted at the end of our discussion.

Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ Marshall thank you “To move freely in and out of the jungle both within yourself and within the world, you cannot be bound to it. You have to know it is not who you are. It becomes the environment in which you serve.(5:57PM)
Robert_Society:  Thank you everyone. Nasi Novare Coram
Aurora_Hawaii:  @Chrysostomos – Such a good solution!
Angela_PA:  Thank you everyone, Nasi Novare Coram
MVS Society:  “What can an enlightened individual do if they are not united with others? Their enlightenment is an illusion if they cannot substantiate it with their relationships, if they cannot enter community and establish a Group Mind in service to Knowledge itself.”
THE ONE BOOK: The Meaning of Spiritual Development
Reed_Society:  @Ayesha, exactly… “For me this experience of “Knowledge” was not profound insight, or big visions. It was more a push towards, or a pull and the back and forth of currents in the ocean.”
Jansett_KY:  Thank you, Patricia, for your profound insight. Wow….
Chrysostomos:  Thanks @Aurora.
Dariel_Boulder:  Thank you, Reed, for your “sense of “feeling right with myself” was my primary compass,
Jim B. Upstate NY:  Thank you MVS for the clarity in looking at where we have all been and are still a part of. I am a part of this world but not of it and in this I am a part of the jungle still and may perhaps always be but not of it.
Shrimayi Netherlands:  Thank you Reed.” I think of the trap of trying to make things happen, instead of seeing what is happening and letting a response arise naturally, if it arises at all. It is the trap of trying too hard to make something happen.(6:07PM)
Tuukka Finland:  Thank you Marshall. Thank you everyone for this hour. Nasi Novare Coram.
Alisa_Russia:  Thank you everyone for all your sharing and insights. I always feel stronger and more grounded in your company.
Tonia _Denmark:  Thank you too, Patricia. The others with the look in the eye, yes. More and more details come to the fabric of this woven greater community of knowing something real. Not made up, but real.
Ellen_Society:  Bless you all for joining us today in this important conversation.
Richmond_UK:  Thank you Marshall for your quote.
Jennie_Netherlands:  It has been powerful today, thank you all
Diane S. New Mexico67759:  Thank you for this session today. Very inspiring. Nasi Novare Coram .
Carolyn_WA:  How true that is @Marshall @ Shrimayi. Something I was contemplating deeply last night: stepping back from my inner turmoil, a jungle in which I became ensnared in one of the many traps that no. Doubt I created. Knowledge gently guided me out.
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ Reed @ Ayesha again how beautifully said “For me this experience of “Knowledge” was not profound insight, or big visions. It was more a push towards, or a pull and the back and forth of currents in the ocean.”(6:10PM)
Carol_Society:  Again, deepest gratitude for each of your insights and inspirations here today. May we grow ever stronger and may our numbers grow, as a small group of “individuals who are ignited with the truth.” Nasi Novare Coram.
Darlene_Society:  Deeply grateful for you all hacking your way through the jungle to rendezvous with the Messenger and all who serve this great cause. Be well. Nasi Novare Coram
Paul_MA:  Much Gratitude to all for today’s chat: Mavran Mavran Conay Mavran
Kari_H_Finland:  So, after drifting in a raft I found the shore but now I had the Lamp with me to see in the jungle…
Cameron_Canada:  @Aurora – much of this world is one big false flag. Events such as 911 are just extreme examples that in some odd way help to show people truth by obviousness of the event.
Tyyne_Society:  Thank you all of you – the growing WWC of students of the New Message. And thank you to Carol and Ayesha for hosting today. And thank you to Marshall Vian, Patricia and Reed.
ray_Colorado:  “The great door of life is not thrown open. It is opened very, very gradually. Why is it gradual? Because it is governed by Wisdom and by the Wise. Consider how long it took them to learn and to unlearn, to evaluate and to re-evaluate, to receive, to accept and to give. They know something about learning here. They have learned to learn, and this is part of their Wisdom. Wisdom, then, is not only being with Knowledge; it is learning to become a vehicle for Knowledge—to abide with Knowledge, to allow Knowledge to express itself through you, to join in the stillness of Knowledge and to utilize the perception of Knowledge. Learning to do this is the great education. It is what could wisely be called Higher Education.” (WGC2.23 Becoming Wise) http://www.newmessage….ume-2
Reed_Society:  Thank you everyone, we will be linking to this campfire chat transcript from MVS’ teaching The Jungle, a conversation of over a hundred students that happened today, 10/7/17, that others can read, gain value from and join in the months and years ahead
Chrysostomos:  Thank you all. Till next Saturday.
Aurora_Hawaii:  @Cameron, Understood – and I think as people get weary of it, they may start to see the truth of that.
Marianna Greece:  Thanks all of you, every session clarifies many thinks because until now my enlightenment was an illusion.It is like my Saturday its presents day now.Thanks again
Susan_Malaysia:  Thank you, MVS, Patricia, Reed the Society and everyone , Nasi Novare Coram
Cameron_Canada:  Thanks Ray – I needed a reminder of that quote. Patience is not always easy.
Alexandra_NL:  May we all work towards entering community and establishing a Group Mind _/l\_
Jos_Netherlands:  Thank you all for this chat. Nasi Novare Coram.
Aurora_Hawaii:  Thanks everyone, for being here. Aloha for now.
Tonia _Denmark:  Thank you, Marshall. Powerful words and responding very much here. Every day, this is a thing that comes to be really important, because when the chat is over and the door is closed, the phone doesnt ring, the quetness moves in…..and thats where the strenght must come in…….where to find others to engage with? …..where to go?…..on the internet….or the outernet?……maybe in the revelations? …..if nothing else, a walk outside and looking at animals are a bliss. Thank you.
Shrimayi Netherlands:  @ oh Patricia “And if ever to encounter another in that jungle, with a similar look in their eye…who may even go on to express clearly and coherently what moves and…(6:07PM)
Patricia_Society: … guides them, to exchange a moment with them like this, oh, is an offshore/onshore gift….And on you will go on, guided by the intermittent signal, now becoming more resident in your mind and body, applying the hard earned lifelong wisdoms of the trail, as you help and you serve here and there
Adria_work:  Thank you all and thank you Marshall. Nasi Novare Coram
Tonia _Denmark:  Thank you, Reed.
Jennie_Netherlands:  @Alexandra, a Master Group Mind
ray_Colorado:  ” … people wonder about the emphasis on stillness. They think, “I am trying to get something done! I am trying to learn something! I am trying to acquire Knowledge. I am trying to figure things out! Why deal with stillness? Well, all right, I’ll practice stillness because if I practice stillness, I’ll get the answers, yes?” No, you get stillness. People don’t see that stillness in itself is the reward. They think stillness is being stupid and passive. The emphasis on stillness, then, seems inexplicable. Its only value to people is that maybe if they are still, they can get what they want. They are still into getting and having and acquiring. They bring their madness to the preparation and try to use the preparation to satisfy their madness and the demands of their madness. But the preparation is such that it will relieve you of your madness, not fulfill it, for madness cannot be fulfilled. That is why it is madness.” (WGC2. 23 Becoming Wise) …
Insuk_Korea:  Thank you Marshall, Patricia, Reed and All. Nasi Novare Coram
Jennie_Netherlands:  @Ray, your input is very valuable to me every time. Thank you
Carolyn_WA:  @ray. To me stillness is like looking into a lake when the water is calm. You can see better into the depths. That is when hidden things become revealed.
ray_Colorado:  “The preparation is a cure for madness.  Steps to Knowledge is a cure for madness,” (WGC2.23 Becoming Wise) http://www.newmessage….ume-2
mellany:  Thank you Marshall, The Society and all. Thanks Ayesha and Carol, for guiding the chat. NNC
Val_Westport:  May the Power of God manifesting through Knowledge lead us through the jungles of ignorance and our ignorant expressions into Higher Service and true maturity for ourselves and our world. Nasi Novare Coram
Kari_H_Finland:  I am grateful for those miracles in our lives which brought each and all of us into this Worldwide Community of Students of Knowledge. Mavran Mavran Conay Mavran.
Shirley-Boulder:  @Carolyn Like that description of stillness.
ray_Colorado:  “You learn to be still because stillness enables you to know things, to penetrate things through your perception and to assimilate things as well. It gives you the presence of mind to recognize that which is beneficial and that which is not, and it does this without condemnation. Stillness gives you the freedom to have peace, but it also gives you the potency for action. Here you are reserving your mental resources and energy. Knowledge is like the archer who exerts effort in pulling back the bow so that when the moment to release the arrow comes, it has real power and direction.” (WGC2.23 Becoming Wise)
Carolyn_WA:  [email protected], it’s borrowed from maybe Confucius. Or one of the learned of ancient China. That when the water is turbulent (with people’s confusion) no one can see clearly. Only when the water is calm then one can see the rocks below. (Paraphrasing).
Ilhun_Korea:  Thank you Marshall, Patricia, Reed and the Society and All. Nasi Novare Coram.
ray_Colorado:  “With Wisdom, you are always giving. You realize you do not understand how you give, although you do understand certain things you can do where giving can occur, and you will be inclined to do those things. But how giving functions through you is a mystery, … and a gracious experience.” (WGC2.23 Becoming Wise) http://www.newmessage….ume-2
Hardev_Australia:  Thank you Ray for quotes from WGC2.23 Becoming Wise.
Shrimayi Netherlands:  Levy is talking now at a ufology gathering, we can think of him and send him strenght.
Keiko_Ita:  Thank you for being here…Nasi Novare Coram.
Katia_France:  Thanks for the information, Shrimayi. Thoughts and encouragements to Levy!
Raoul_Australia:  Thank you everyone, see you next week, Nasi Novare Coram
Sonia London UK:  Hello all and many many thanks
ray_Colorado:  “When you are with knowledge, you can afford to be kind because you are not rushing about the world trying to fulfill your goals and assure your security. You are able to be in present time with far greater effectiveness and far greater presence of mind. If you are not rushing about, you become aware of what is here now, and you become responsive to the genuine needs of those whom you are meant to serve. You can afford to be compassionate when you are with Knowledge because Knowledge recognizes where people are without demanding that they be different. Knowledge fosters understanding based upon acceptance. It does not project hopeful ideas, yet it does not deny the needs of anyone. It moves you towards certain people and away from others without condemnation. It teaches you over time to recognize that there are stages in life, and each stage has its advantages and liabilities.” (WGC2.30 Kindness) http://www.newmessage….ume-2
MaryS_Boulder:  About “substantiation,” I cannot resist pointing out the only place a lot of people have ever even heard of it would be with “trans-” in front of it. A word I have contemplated even lately.
ray_Colorado:  “With Knowledge, you can afford kindness kindness because you want to nurture things, and you want yourself and the people around you to be grounded in what is real and genuine. Here your kindness is not always sweet. Sometimes it is demanding. Sometimes it produces a confrontation, but it is kind because it asks others to honor themselves enough to be real with you and with themselves. It asks this through the way you live, the way you think and the way you interact with others. You can afford to be kind when you are with Knowledge because you are not trying to change anyone. You are only stimulating their inherent abilities. You are not trying to seduce anyone in order to get things from them, to win their love or to gain their financial assistance. With Knowledge you are not condemning them, and this allows kindness to naturally emerge in all of its vast array of expressions.” (WGC2.30 Kindness)
MVS Society:  Want nothing from the Jungle and you will begin to experience freedom from it. Taking the Steps up the mountain, you will rise above this jungle and see it compassionately and with gratitude for giving you the vision and the commitment to find and follow the clear path out.
Jansett_KY:  Moved to share a long passage that serves as my daily bedrock out here in the jungle. It keeps me going and expands my gratitude for the One who came forth to provide and demonstrate living the Way of Knowledge, Marshall Vian Summers. This is from Wisdom from the Greater Community Volume I, Chapter 13, “Spiritual Community”:
“This life is a transition to another life. To come into this world, you are born into a life from a life. You go through this life and enter into another life. People think of lifetimes only in terms of visitation rights to this planet, but you go from life to life, context to context. Why is the future relevant here? Why are these spiritual things so important? This life is preparation, like childhood is preparation for adulthood. Adulthood is preparation for your Spiritual Family, who will be waiting for you when you arrive and pass through the thin membrane that separates these two realms of existence….
“True community in the world must be very small, or…
Betty_UK:  Thank you Marshall the importance of group mind in service of Knowledge -MVS “What can an enlightened individual do if they are not united with others? Their enlightenment is an illusion if they cannot substantiate it with their relationships, if they cannot enter community and establish a Group Mind in service to Knowledge itself.”
THE ONE BOOK: The Meaning of Spiritual Development”
Jansett_KY:  … it cannot be a community of Knowledge. The world must join in community, but it will not be a community of Knowledge because Knowledge is not preferred here. The results of Knowledge, however, are greatly needed here because the results of Knowledge care for people.
“The average person is not interested in Knowledge because the race has not evolved that far. So it is not wise to go out and try to change people because you will hurt them if you do. If you take a society of people and try to make life better for them, you will end up killing half of them. This is not a negative thought. It is real.
“You see, God does not expect everyone to get his or her life together now. Everything is moving along. Yet you can feel the fire of contribution. Something must be done; you must be the person to do it, and you must gather others to help you. This fire of contribution is in no way contradictory to accepting the world exactly the way it is. It is only contradictory in terms of ambitions….
Jansett_KY:  … The man and woman of Knowledge will go about their work regardless of circumstances, and if the world in general is no better at the end of their life, what does it matter? They gave all. They do not take people and condemn them for not getting better.
“Therefore, a community of Knowledge must be very small because it is extremely intimate, but it will be life giving to the community at large, which is society. It is these little embers that keep the fire going. What has kept Knowledge alive in the world? What has enabled humanity to progress as a race but small enclaves of individuals, hidden, working away? Occasionally, an individual will come forth who will make a public display or demonstration. This is what has kept the embers burning.
“Think not that God is going to ask you to go out and make the world better. It is not like that. Something inside of you will overtake you. Something greater than your mind will overtake you and lead you to certain people. It will lead you to…
Jansett_KY:  … give in certain ways and from this, good will be given to the world, though it is not necessarily the good that you would want to give.”
Val_Westport:  Thank you Patricia; I just read your beautiful and useful share of 12:07. What a Blessing you are!
ray_Colorado:  “To be genuinely kind is to recognize a Greater Reality in another and to nurture and support that without denying that person’s present state. To be compassionate is to understand conflict and failure and to realize that until people have gained a foundation in Knowledge, they are prone to self-deception. They will be captured by the fascinations of the world, and they will be prone to all the miseries that attend such fascinations. And they will be fretful, fearful and defensive. You will understand this because you will have experienced it yourself, and having found the way out of this state, you will be able to provide a way for others ….. so that they too may find their way.” (WGC2.30 Kindness) http://www.newmessage….ume-2
Tonia _Denmark:  Thank you, Marshall….
Virgie_near Seattle:  @ray: if only one could learn stillness by reading about practicing stillness.  I’ve always found it very easy to assimilate ideas … but to take the actual journey, well … it’s a whole different matter. Now trying to do something I find so difficult I can barely even begin (at least, I *think* I’ve begun) … and not knowing whether I will ever become even basically competent … I looked at myself this week and said, “Why on earth am I giving up so much for this?” but it wasn’t a complaint, just kind of … feeling bemused.
Joe_UK:  Thank you All for being here and for your participation. May we continue steadfastly moving out of the jungle, building and strengthening the foundation of Knowledge together. NNC
Katia_France:  Thank you, Marshall: “Want nothing from the Jungle and you will begin to experience freedom from it.” That is definitely the key. And I feel I am experiencing this freedom more and more little by little, thanks to my studenthood.
Shrimayi Netherlands:  Thank you Jansett!
Mike_LF_CAL:  Thanks everyone! Have a date with a green guy on the beach. MMCM NNC
Alexandra_NL:  @Jansett_KY “The man and woman of Knowledge will go about their work regardless of circumstances, and if the world in general is no better at the end of their life, what does it matter? They gave all.” …. 
Shrimayi Netherlands:  Thank you Marshall,Patricia,Reed,Ayesha,Carol and all of you! Nasi Novare Coram.
MVS Society:  Conspiracy is alluring, but it is still the Jungle.
Shirley-Boulder:  @jansett Something greater than your mind will overtake you and lead you to certain people. It will lead to give in certain way. This resonates with me.
ray_Colorado:  Virgie_near Seattle: “God has given you a perfect guidance system within yourself, which We call Knowledge. You may also call it the Holy Spirit, if you wish. It is an inner guidance system. In a very pervasive way, it is exerting its influence on you continuously, and on rare occasions it will actually move you to do something and motivate you in a very strong way. The power of your Knowledge is tremendous, and it is safely hidden within you in such a way that you cannot meddle with it. ” (WGC1.20 Inner Listening) http://www.newmessage….ume-1
Tonia _Denmark:  Virgie, kind of this I feel too….like a child….why give up so much?…..for this?…..but deep down I have already been there…..I know where it leads………enough to come back….though the path is not clear..
ray_Colorado:  “To become a true listener, you must learn silence and feel comfortable in silence. This is natural for those who are beginning to practice meditation and are beginning to be receptive within themselves. They will seek out quiet more and more frequently, seeking refuge from the noise of the outside world.

There are very important qualities that a listener must develop, qualities that have tremendous benefit in all aspects of life. You must become used to silence. You must become very courageous, which means you are willing to see things and hear things that have direct bearing on your life. You must learn to be very patient. You must learn to trust your own experience to a high degree. You must learn to be discerning, for much of what you hear will be quite useless. You must be determined to penetrate your own thoughts. You must be persistent, have great regard for yourself and treat yourself graciously.

These qualities are developed naturally because what you are attempting to do is…
ray_Colorado:  … so important. It is so valuable for those who know you. We would never expect anyone to undertake this quality of development for themselves alone. There are very few people who feel they would deserve the benefits. But when you think that you will be able to serve others in a very direct and meaningful way, this gives great impetus and encouragement, for your gifts are meant for others.

You are merely one of the beneficiaries of your own gifts.” (WGC1.20 Inner Listening) http://www.newmessage….ume-1

ray_Colorado:  “Inner listening is such a major part of your development. It enables you to respond to communications from your Teachers, from others in your life and from your own Knowledge. It takes time to develop this, indeed, yet it is time well spent. Every few moments you spend listening without judgment save you such great amounts of time and bring you so much closer to your goal.

It is this great meeting place between your conscious mind and your deeper, impersonal mind that unifies you and makes you a force of unification in life. This is what Christ means. Christ means that your personal life has been anointed with Knowledge. You have touched yourself. God has touched you. And now you can touch others.” (WGC1.20 Inner Listening) http://www.newmessage….ume-1

Virgie_near Seattle:  Thank you, Tonia.
Val_Westport:  To remember, when the fragrance of the jungle flowers is sweet, when the mysteries and intrigues of life beckon, to come back to knowledge before our power drains away–that is the challenge. Thank you for being the reminder, Marshall, Patricia, Reed and fellow students. May we be each other’s training wheels, while we learn to serve in the power of Knowledge for the benefit of others and our world, not alone, but from our own.
MVS Society:  Knowledge is the signal. The Jungle is the noise. But you must listen to the Jungle to discern the signal. The signal is sent continually into the jungle, yet you will likely only experience the signal intermittently here and there, but that is enough to keep you moving in the right direction.
Jim B. Upstate NY:  Thank you to MVS, Patricia and Reed for you journey out of the jungle and the ability to shed a great deal of light to us about life’s makeup and design. Thank you to all Society members for you journy’s as well for they are demonstrations that it can and must be done. Thank you to all my fellow students for hacking your way out of the jungle and taking time to sharpen your tools together! Until next Saturday be well all! “Stillness is one of the essential qualities in healing.” Nasi Novare Coram
Tonia _Denmark:  Thank you, Ray. Which leads me to the part of penetrating the guilt feeling of letting others down. To aquire stillness.
Betty_UK:  Why following others, with conspiracy. while you have a guiding compass inside yourself? Your deeper current of your life, Knowledge.
Eron_Boulder:  Blessings everyone…Nasi Novare Coram
Arthur:  Does anyone know why I feel such a powerful state of despair, anger and condemnation? I tried giving it a constructive release in stillness but there were nothing tangible to be found in my emotions. So here I am unable to find the answer because I am unable to see the problem.
MaryS_Boulder:  Arthur, one of the questions that could be asked at such times is, where is this coming from? That is the question I hear you asking. Good question.
Cole_Boulder:  Thank you Marshall!
Selma Londons Jungle ;):  Betty, the Jungle – a place to ‘see’ the truth; that grain of truth in conspiracy, is it not? Eventually, anyway? Perhaps that’s too far down the line, but there are examples already of how conspiracies have proved to be quite accurate after all, haven’t they? Thank you MVS & all. NNC
11441:  Benjamin ; Is conspiracy a problem as you see it Betty..?
Cole_Boulder:  I think the jungle analogy is also akin to the analogy to the needle in the haystack. From ‘Courage and the Will to Prepare’ : “It is like the needle in the haystack, as people say. Well, you have to remove a lot of hay to find that needle. That is what your preparation is largely about—to remove that which is false, that which is unreal, that which you are bound to [what] you desire, that you do not really need. It is not necessary, and therefore it is a distraction and an obsession for you.”
Adria_work:  @Marshall, thank you so much. Thank you for your presence.
ray_Colorado:  Arthur “”Do not value pride. Uncover it. Let disappointment and even disgrace help you come to terms with your true nature in life.” …. “”Your frame of reference is far too limited to comprehend the meaning of your life and to experience and enjoy the mystery of your life. Disappointment is tremendously valuable in making you alert by shaking you out of a fixed mental reference and framework.” (The New Message)
Arthur:  I tried doing that MaryS but all I could see at the moment was that I’ve lost a hope in a meaningful life. But I still felt that this was only a partial answer.
Betty_UK:  There is a grain a of truth in most things, but does it take you away from where you need to be, do, follow?
Tonia _Denmark:  Thank you, Marshall….taking notes…
MaryS_Boulder:  Those partial answers keep you going, right, Arthur?
Arthur:  Having no faith in life is not a good motivator. What keeps me going is that I don’t want it all to end yet.
Arthur:  I know I am capable of much, but I’ve yet to got chance to demonstrate it.
Tyyne_Society:  Thank you, MVS Society: “Knowledge is the signal. The Jungle is the noise. But you must listen to the Jungle to discern the signal. The signal is sent continually into the jungle, yet you will likely only experience the signal intermittently here and there, but that is enough to keep you moving in the right direction.” This is really helpful when working/being/looking out into the world.
Alexandra_NL:  “Knowledge is the signal. The Jungle is the noise. But you must listen to the Jungle to discern the signal. The signal is sent continually into the jungle, yet you will likely only experience the signal intermittently here and there, but that is enough to keep you moving in the right direction.”MVS… amaaaaziiing grace, how sweeeeet the sound, thaaat saaaaaved a wreck like meeee….
MVS Society:  Yes Ray, Steps is the cure for madness!
11441:  Benjamin ; MVS Society “Conspiracy” is folly. To say you don’t want to know what you don’t know is a little ill-advised,,,
ray_Colorado:  Arthur” “You are given the steps. Follow them. Be strong today. Only your ideas of yourself speak of weakness. Only your evaluation of yourself says that you are pathetic, incapable or inadequate. You must have faith in your strength and exercise this faith to realize your strength.” Steps to Knowledge Step 198 Today I will be strong.http://stepstoknowledg…g.htm
Joyanne_Canada:  thank you Ray..
Jim B. Upstate NY:  @Arthur it is not about you or about me but about “us” and the gifts of service and contribution that we have to give to the world. I have found that when I feel at times the way you do I need to be of service to another. This takes me away from my self obsession and brings me closer to others, life and the world. Try it sometime if you have not already. You will be overcome with joy in how it directs you and what you can begin to feel for life.
Tonia _Denmark:  Arthur, in any case, stay with the steps and the revelation. They provide the work.
Tonia _Denmark:  Steps is the cure for madness ❤
11441:  Benjamin ; MVS Society Are you someone who considers it important to know the bare basics of the world…? Is there some confusion about either / or? I am not advocating either or. You need both to prepare for life, I don’t think anyone would argue with that…
Virgie_near Seattle:  Oh, whoops–I think I missed a pm from someone and now it’s gone forever, sorry.
Tonia _Denmark:  Can you give your gifts in the city?
Betty_UK:  @11441 Benjamin – what do you trully value?
MVS Society:  Arthur be kind and patient with yourself. Anger, frustration, sadness, despair all come up along the way to be flushed out of you. This is all the detritus of Separation.
ray_Colorado:  Retreana Carvedan Celton Iy: “Receive the Heart of God through your Spiritual Family that is joined about you.” Nasi Novare Coram
David Drimmel:  MVS to Arthur – I needed to hear that. Thank you.
11441:  Betty that questions not realistic.
11441:  Betty What shoes’ do you wear? “Lefts” or “Rights” ?
Tonia _Denmark:  I needed that one too, thank you, Marshall, thank you, Arthur for sharing.
Hyeonam_Korea:  Thank you all. Thank you MVS. Several days ago I felt very sad about me but I recognized the feeling was from Knowledge maybe. I will care about emotion. Thank you lead and save me. NASI NOVARE CORAM
Arthur:  @MaryS No you are right, the partial answer it is was keeps me going. I was too hasty with me response.
David Drimmel:  “Steps to Knowledge is the cure for madness” – If there are things hindering this stillness, such as tinnitus or ringing in the ears, and there is no cure for it, then the ringing is just another part of the jungle I suppose.
David Drimmel:  The ringing is madness.
Joyanne_Canada:  @David , if the ringing gets to bad.. which at times it does.. I play the Revelations in my mp3 player it then lets me focus on the Voice.. and overlays the ringing..
Betty_UK:  11441: I know for myself what I value. You can know what you value for yourself, and you will know in time.
Kelton:  Thank you all! NNC
Tonia _Denmark:  Good question David
ray_Colorado:  David Drimmel: “Clearly, everyone in the world, even the youngest child, is acquainted with suffering—physical pain, emotional pain, psychological pain, the pain of Separation, the pain of living in a difficult environment in the physical reality. This pain has many dimensions. It is certainly associated with need and with fear, and aggravation of some kind.” (Suffering) http://www.newmessage….world
11441:  “What I value” is not sensible discussion for a chat forum idt
ray_Colorado:  “Dis-ease, ….”
11441:  It’s rather a big subject and not what I am speaking about
11441:  Gosh that’s patronising Betty. Excruciatingly patronising. No offence.
ray_Colorado:  “…. here is the question of asking for guidance.
People are very confused about this, because they ask about something and then they expect an immediate answer. And if they do not get an answer within 5 minutes, they think that nothing is happening and they go back into guessing.” (The Inner Voice, December 8, 2008)
Arthur:  Well now I don’t feel as bad anymore and would like to have some fun !
Arthur:  Just when everyone is leaving..
Tonia _Denmark:  Lol well that could be me sometimes. Thank you, Ray. You really give so much to chat.
Josef Austria:  Thank you all for your presence and your sharing! Thank you Ray for your quotes! They are always very helpful! Nasi Novare Coram!
Howard Boulder:  Great to be with you all
Betty_UK:  Thank you everyone NNC
manuel germany :):  Deep gratitude to all who directed the chat today and all the wisdom and experiences shared. A big hug also to the people who think that they know more than others trying to persuade to think like theirselves. Nasi Novare Coram   
Virgie_near Seattle:  “With this, you will see the limit of your own ideas or your fixed beliefs, and you will see with great clarity how others are so deeply associated with these things, but which they have no real strength or power underneath this. There is no foundation. You will see so many things with compassion. You will see Knowledge in others. You will see the need for Knowledge everywhere. And all of Our words will make perfect sense to you at last, for you will see that they are true everywhere.” The Lamp.
Tonia _Denmark:  I am not very good with reading all the time, as I am terribly in need of learning to be with people again, but part of me realizes the childish mind and the adult mind within. The adult must show the way for the child….and ask the child the proper questions to know what the child needs…..what is it afraid of….why…. Like a reporter I sometimes sit down and asks questions and answets on a paper….just like a reporter would do to a person for an interview.



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